Matchday Thread - West Bromwich Albion v Arsenal - 21 November 2015

that is one shit of a show.... back to arsenal ways. :(

Losing coq is worse than losing the points.

"Don't add cover for Coquelin as it could hinder his development"

In central midfield we have Coquelin, Wilshere, Ramsey, Santi and (Flamini Arteta). I don't think there's room for another one. Problem is that apart from Santi they're all injured currently.

Only 1 of them can play in the Coquelin role effectively though, and that's Coquelin.

Quelle surprise were lacking in a position we needed to strengthen. Vital that we sign a DM & a winger in January if we want to seriously challenge for the title.

Quelle surprise were lacking in a position we needed to strengthen.

This changes every month though. In the summer everyone was screaming for a striker, now we're screaming for a DM. In December maybe we're screaming for a LB. We can't sign players based on potential injuries.

Beating the drum about a DM and RW/ST since the summer. If we consider Theo as a striker then we need a RW & vice versa.

To go into the season trying to 'challenge for the title' with Arteta & Flamini as the only back up DM's is absolutely absurd.

To go into the season trying to 'challenge for the title' with Arteta & Flamini as the only back up DM's is absolutely absurd.

But realistically, do Barca/Real/Bayern/Man City/Juventus/etc have better DM backups than we do? Most likely not. Why should we be the only team on the planet with world class second-choice players? No one else has that, it's simply not realistic to have 25 world class players in a squad.

But realistically, do Barca/Real/Bayern/Man City/Juventus/etc have better DM backups than we do? Most likely not. Why should we be the only team on the planet with world class second-choice players? No one else has that, it's simply not realistic to have 25 world class players in a squad.

I'm not asking for World Class back ups, it's really not hard to get someone in whose better than Arteta & Flamini who are absolutely terrible. The likes of Fernando & Casemiro are infinitely better than the aforementioned. Ideally our back up to Coquelin should be a younger version of Arteta; someone like Sergi Samper probably would've been perfect, especially if you pair him alongside someone like Wilshere/Ramsey next to him who are more dominant physically & not afraid to put in a defensive shift.

I'm not asking for World Class back ups, it's really not hard to get someone in whose better than Arteta & Flamini who are absolutely terrible. The likes of Fernando & Casemiro are infinitely better than the aforementioned. Ideally our back up to Coquelin should be a younger version of Arteta; someone like Sergi Samper probably would've been perfect, especially if you pair him alongside someone like Wilshere/Ramsey next to him who are more dominant physically & not afraid to put in a defensive shift.

I think you have a distorted view on reality if you think Fernando, Casemiro or Samper are better backups than Flamini or Arteta. Listen, I'm not saying Arteta or Flamini are great players, but I also think we're in a weird position where we think it's realistic to have second- or third-choice players that are able to come in and perform even close to our first-choice ones. Especially since Coquelin is most likely one of the best DMs on the planet right now - anyone would pale in comparison.

I think it's more realistic to look inwards. Bielik was extremely tidy and solid when he came on against Sheffield Wednesday. He deserves the same chance Coquelin got. Give him the opportunity and see what happens. Worst case scenario he's not ready, best case scenario we replicate Coquelin's success story.

All 3 are much better than Flamini & Arteta. I think you're underestimating how bad Flamini & Arteta actually are now. 2/3 years ago they would've been fine, not anymore. They are terrible.

I personally love Coquelin and wouldn't trade him for anyone, but he isn't a great footballer. He's essentially a boosted up, non-cunty version of Scott Parker. A true terrier DM in which all you need is good acceleration, strength and a decent level of intelligence. But that's all we needed as we have Santi & Özil to pull the strings.

I'm all for giving Bielik a chance as he does look very tidy but I have a couple of issues. Firstly he's played as a CB all season for the youth team and secondly we can't be serious contenders with a 17 year old in one of the most important areas on the pitch for us. We even had the best 17 year old I've seen play for us in Fabregas alongside Gilberto, Thierry, Pires etc and we still wasn't able to win the League.

But I'd really like a deep lying DM so we can move Ramsey back centrally & play with another winger. I don't think Wenger trusts Coq-Ramsey due to their inability to pull the strings. Santi works well there because Coquelin does the work, lays it off to Santi who is able to look around & play the correct pass. In a Coq-Rambo pairing they don't have what it takes to dictate the tempo & usually rush it as much as possible.

We really, really need a couple of signings in January. This League is absolute bobbins at the moment and we're still a bit off. An Arshavin-esque couple of signings would really boost morale as well as squad depth& could be enough to win it. Nolito & a DM would be perfect (as well as starting Kos & Gabs together).

Wouldn't mind seeing Bielik get a run. Maybe Chambers can start playing like he promised he could at the start of last season.

I think you have a distorted view on reality if you think Fernando, Casemiro or Samper are better backups than Flamini or Arteta. Listen, I'm not saying Arteta or Flamini are great players, but I also think we're in a weird position where we think it's realistic to have second- or third-choice players that are able to come in and perform even close to our first-choice ones. Especially since Coquelin is most likely one of the best DMs on the planet right now - anyone would pale in comparison.I think it's more realistic to look inwards. Bielik was extremely tidy and solid when he came on against Sheffield Wednesday. He deserves the same chance Coquelin got. Give him the opportunity and see what happens. Worst case scenario he's not ready, best case scenario we replicate Coquelin's success story.

I would love that to happen. AW is not giving young guns as many chances as he used to. I would even put Chambers as a DM.

All 3 are much better than Flamini & Arteta. I think you're underestimating how bad Flamini & Arteta actually are now. 2/3 years ago they would've been fine, not anymore.

I don't know. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle of our extremes. I just can't see any of our competitors have much better second- or third-choice players than we do. Bayern and Barca have a few really interesting youngsters, but other than that there's a huge drop between first- and second-choice, even at oil-rich clubs.

Look at Chelsea...difference between Matic and Mikel, likewise between Fabregas and Ramires. It's a huge difference in quality.

Our squad is not the problem, we have the quality everywhere. Its the damn injuries. OR, i'm wrong, and we need to buy additional 11 first team players and put them in cryosleep (this could be great solution around the 25 man squad rule), so they are ready for when the time come.

Also worth pointing out that a player doesn't have to be very good to play well. Plenty of teams have gone far in competitions, or even won them, despite having mediocre players. Look at Leicester. They are top of the league. Are you suggesting it's because their players are individually better than ours?

Whether Flamini or Arteta are good enough is irrelevant. The question is: is Wenger good enough to utilise and bring out the best in them?

Also worth pointing out that a player doesn't have to be very good to play well. Plenty of teams have gone far in competitions, or even won them, despite having mediocre players. Look at Leicester. They are top of the league. Are you suggesting it's because their players are individually better than ours?Whether Flamini or Arteta are good enough is irrelevant. The question is: is Wenger good enough to utilise and bring out the best in them?

Wenger is more than good enough. As for Leicester, they have the league's leading goal scorer on top form. When Vardy goes on a drought, they will slip down. So yes, at the moment they have a striker better than anyone else.

Wenger is more than good enough. As for Leicester, they have the league's leading goal scorer on top form. When Vardy goes on a drought, they will slip down. So yes, at the moment they have a striker better than anyone else.

Leicester is just one example, although it's extremely dismissive to think Vardy is the only reason they are up there. Mahrez has arguably been the better player of the two, and their defenders have played very well. The point is that Flamini and Arteta are good enough. They aren't the bottleneck. The bottleneck is whether Wenger can bring the best out of them or not.

They've conceded 20 goals....

They've conceded 20 goals....

I was talking about individual performances, that was the topic. De Laet and Simpson have played very well. Either way, the point is again ignored: football is a team sport. It's very rarely about individual performances, unless you have Messi or Ronaldo in your side. And it has been proven countless times that you can win trophies and/or compete on the highest level with mediocre players in your side. All you need is a superior gameplan and a manager who is able to exploit his players strengths and weaknesses.